Author Topic: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange  (Read 117290 times)

Offline WoodTech

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Overview

As has been hinted we've been busy these last few weeks preparing a new crypto-securities exchange for CIPHERMINE and several other securities! Some details are below, and I'd welcome the community's input. We want to make this the best exchange service out there and to provide a resilient, long-lived platform on which the crypto-securities economy can flourish.

We are going all-out for scale and fully intend to dominate the crypto-securities market. We have secured over $100k in seed funding which during the early months is being spent on legal fees, staffing, software development and security (pen tests etc). Post-launch the remainder of the fund (at least half) will be spent on an aggressive marketing and sales campaign. We shall be IPO'ing CipherTrade itself on its own exchange to give everyone an opportunity to  join in our vision, and to raise further funding to continue to expand rapidly.

Further, we have identified a hugely exciting target market outside the usual crypto-security space. I don't wish to weaken our competitive advantage by sharing too much, but suffice to say we fully intend to be "main stream".

The team

This is a collaborative effort between the following people. Executive team and staff:
  • woodtech - me, a multi-award winning British entrepreneur, founder and CEO of CipherMine and Memset Hosting.
  • Si (not on the forum) - founder and CEO of [http://zone.in]Zone.In[/url], and our lead developer
  • evilscoop - my right hand man in cipherspace, and operations manager for CipherTrade
  • analbeard & Ross (not on forum) - two of my top systems administrators at Memset (Ross is on our home page).
Advisory board and investors:
  • krypto - one of the biggest alt-coin "whales" and a former major shareholder in Litecoin Global.
  • Deprived - the hugely respected and knowledgeable manager of several cryptosecurities on BTC-TC and LTC-G
  • Benny - alt-coin and mining guru, founder of BUY-A-HASH
  • OgonDark (on bitcointalk), a futures broker with decades of experience, and founder of BTCFunds
Note that CipherMine is also among the "investors", or more specifically CipherMine shareholders. We've yet to work out exactly how much / what ratio but all CipherMine shareholders will get a little slice of CipherTrade.

We also have a number of issuers from who have committed to listing on CipherTrade. Some of the securities we expect to have from the outset include:
  • CIPHERMINE, CIPHERMINE.B1 & CIPHERMINE-PT
  • DMS.MINING, DMS.SELLING & DMS.PURCHASE
  • BUY-A-HASH
  • LTC-CHARTS (cryptocoincharts.info)
  • S.OPENRIGS
We're in talks to get some of our favorite providers like multipool.us on board as well. Note that the exact roles in this are finalised (we've not signed contracts and such). Deprived is still considering the level of his involvement for instance.

Features at launch

Ability to trade the following cryptocurrencies with the lowest trading fees on the market:
  • Bitcoin (BTC)
  • Litecoin (LTC)
  • Primecoin (XPM)
  • Namecoin (NMC)
  • Peercoin (PPC)
Note that the above list is just the ones we're sure about. We will likely add others. Also, all possible currency pairs will be tradeable. The rough plan is to have a market for every coin, under which you'll be able to see all securities as well as all other coins. You will then be able to drill down into one coin or security within that market to view charts and trade etc.

Ability to create securities which can be sold to users of the site for any of the above cryptocurrencies. Initially we'll be offering the following types:
  • Profit share - what it says on the tin
  • Fund - a managed portfolio
  • Bond - a fixed yield instrument, with the underlying capital redeemable by either party (on specified terms)
  • Loan - an interest-bearing instrument which is progressively paid down over time
It will be possible for site users to trade contract shares after their IPO as well of course. We will be sharing the trading fees with security issuers.

Other features planned from the outset include:
  • A fully live AJAX-driven site (ie. more like Cryptsy than BTCTC/LTCG so you don't need to reload pages)
  • A chat/trollbox integrated - similar in style to mcxNOW or BTC-E
  • An integrated forum focused on crypto-security discussions, with a sub-board for each security
  • Automated import of securities from LTCG/BTCTC using shareholder reports, including creation of all shareholder accounts
  • Top-notch customer support and service provided by full-time staff
  • A highly-scalable architecture for consistent high-performance, low-latency trading
  • API which replicates the functions of LTCG/BTCTC
  • No withdrawal limits nor delays
Planned features to be added later
  • Option trading
  • Time-limited orders
  • Automatic coin trading (auto-selling facility like Cryptsy)
  • Facility for motions / votes to be created, with a fair and enforced policy applied to all
  • Portfolio sharing (for funds)
  • More contract types
  • Paybans for the trollbox, similar to mcxNOW's
Regulation and compliance

The most important feature of CipherTrade is that we are working hard to ensure that we're going to be around for a very long time. We have engaged BDO as our lawyers and are progressing discussions with them. At this time the regulatory environment in the UK, where most of us are based, is fairly relaxed about cryptocoins.

At this time we don't believe that we need to be regulated since BDO's view is that cryptocoins are probably "beans" or vouchers under UK law. We would therefore be operating a sort-of barter and contract brokerage service.

However, our intention is to operate in a transparent manner and work with the relevant authorities to comply with any necessary regulation. There is a good precedence for this in the UK; our online gambling industry worked with the authorities rather than try to be surreptitious and as a result we are world-leaders in that space.

My team and I are expert in compliance, and looking ahead we'll also be implementing a security and quality standards to ensure the best management systems as the business grows.

We also feel that it is important to maintain the integrity of the exchange, and to that end we will be including basic due diligence as part of the process for approving new securities. It will be possible for security issuers to be anonymous from their shareholders if they wish, but not from us. Shareholder contracts shall be deemed as legally binding - it is not a "game".

Where we're at

The software development for the new site is at an advanced stage. We have a stateless trading engine in the webserver with locking handled by the DB - unlike MCXnow we only lock what we need.

We've paid a lot of attention to race conditions too, for example withdrawing when you're involved with a trade.

The replica of the BTC-TC/LTC-G API is coming along very well. It already supports all of the following:
  • authentication / authorisation (with 2FA)
  • ability to list, update and delete a security
  • ability to list shares in a security
  • ability to trade between any pair of coin types the webserver is told about
  • ability to trade in securities
  • seeing your own historic transactions
  • withdrawing coins
  • depositing coins
  • ability to pay out dividends
Only bits of API yet to come are publishing chat, notifications and new trades; being able to pick your security orders by coin; and testing of being able to see your past transactions for securities.

The biggest piece of work that remains is getting the GUI slick and pretty. We're actually sub-contracting that bit outside the main team, but thanks to the work on the API it is proving easy to progress.

We will soon be starting penetration tests with our CHECK-approved partner, Encription. Obviously security is paramount so we want to ensure we've rattled all the latches before public release. The site itself will be hosted on Memset's ISO27001-accredited, CESG (the UK's NSA) IL2-certified infrastructure platform.

What we'd like from you

We are still a few weeks from launch; we don't want to rush and push out a premature product. This  means that there is an opportunity to influence the final service and to that end we would value input from the community. Let us know what you think! :)

Kate.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2013, 04:36:46 PM by WoodTech »

Offline bunkboy

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2013, 08:48:59 PM »
ease of use is important

also, probably the MOST important thing is security. spend 10x the time working on this.

obviously you don't have to go into all the details but, how will the access to coins be secured against hacks or "fake hacks"

gl

Offline WoodTech

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2013, 08:58:33 PM »
ease of use is important

Absolutely. We will be taking the best from what's out there and improving it. Lots of charts, etc, though some of the pretties will have to wait a little.

Quote
also, probably the MOST important thing is security. spend 10x the time working on this.

For sure. I'm a security expert and believe me we'll be paying a lot of attention to this!

Quote
obviously you don't have to go into all the details but, how will the access to coins be secured against hacks or "fake hacks"

We will be ensuring that only users can access their accounts, with pen testing to ensure segregation. In terms of account security, we will be offering Google Auth for 2 factor authentication, the ability to lock withdrawal addresses, email confirmations and so forth. In other words, we'll be providing users with the tools they need to manage their account security.

We'll also be doing the usual rate-limiting on login attempts and so forth, using Captchas as necessary (we don't want them to get in the way, so only when we see multiple failed attempts). The system will be architected such that even if somehow one of our wallet servers were to be compromised (highly unlikely as they will not be publicly visible on the 'net) the damage would be limited.

Obviously if someone chooses not to use those facilities, has password-only access and chooses a crap password, they might get hacked. That's their problem though; it can't adversely affect other users.

We will also police activity on the exchange to an extent. We've not figured out the specifics, but will use algorithms to detect anomalous behavior. We want to discourage pump and dumps, that sort of thing - they are not good for the crypto-economy.

Offline turbooster

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2013, 09:10:55 PM »
Nice to hear.
We also have a number of issuers from who have committed to listing on CipherTrade. Some of the securities we expect to have from the outset include:
  • CIPHERMINE, CIPHERMINE.B1 & CIPHERMINE-PT
Will CIPHERMINE and CIPHERMINE-PT be one then?

Other features planned from the outset include:
  • A fully live AJAX-driven site (ie. more like Cryptsy than BTCTC/LTCG so you don't need to reload pages)
  • A chat/trollbox integrated - similar in style to mcxNOW or BTC-E
  • An integrated forum focused on crypto-security discussions, with a sub-board for each security
  • Automated import of securities from LTCG/BTCTC using shareholder reports, including creation of all shareholder accounts
  • Top-notch customer support and service provided by full-time staff
  • A highly-scalable architecture for consistent high-performance, low-latency trading
  • API which replicates the functions of LTCG/BTCTC
  • No withdrawal limits nor delays
Will the API be the same as it was on ltcg i.e. verbatim for trading and stuff? Or just functionally the same?
Integrating the forum is interesting. Hope there wont be clash of interests right there...

Also, will you categorically exclude doing highly questionable stuff like the labcoin IPO? Are there statutes of any sort?

EDIT for clarity: I'm not talking about labcoin itself being a scam but rather the way its IPO was handled.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2013, 10:51:53 PM by turbooster »

Offline wolfiniflow

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2013, 09:17:52 PM »
The following will be listing on your board:
DMS.MINING, DMS.SELLING & DMS.PURCHASE
BUY-A-HASH
LTC-CHARTS (cryptocoincharts.info)
S.OPENRIGS


Were any of the owners of these securities promised shares or kickbacks in ciphertrade for listing on the site?

Offline Benny

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2013, 10:12:42 PM »
Nice to hear.
We also have a number of issuers from who have committed to listing on CipherTrade. Some of the securities we expect to have from the outset include:
  • CIPHERMINE, CIPHERMINE.B1 & CIPHERMINE-PT
Will CIPHERMINE and CIPHERMINE-PT be one then?

Other features planned from the outset include:
  • A fully live AJAX-driven site (ie. more like Cryptsy than BTCTC/LTCG so you don't need to reload pages)
  • A chat/trollbox integrated - similar in style to mcxNOW or BTC-E
  • An integrated forum focused on crypto-security discussions, with a sub-board for each security
  • Automated import of securities from LTCG/BTCTC using shareholder reports, including creation of all shareholder accounts
  • Top-notch customer support and service provided by full-time staff
  • A highly-scalable architecture for consistent high-performance, low-latency trading
  • API which replicates the functions of LTCG/BTCTC
  • No withdrawal limits nor delays
Will the API be the same as it was on ltcg i.e. verbatim for trading and stuff? Or just functionally the same?
Integrating the forum is interesting. Hope there wont be clash of interests right there...

Also, will you categorically exclude doing highly questionable stuff like the labcoin IPO? Are there statutes of any sort?

I can only speak towards what I've discussed with the other advisers, but I believe its in our best interest to have a rock-solid TOS between issuers and buyers, with a heavy emphasis on due diligence at the listing level. As part of the advisory board, I am going to do my best to ensure no scams are ever listed on such an exchange - and I believe that this has been echoed by other advisers/board members. If BAH and myself become a part of this, and we have the capital to do such, I would personally like to visit all potential US securities prior to approving them for on-site verifications. I think it would add an extra layer of due diligence to the process. I (personally) believe that the Labcoin IPO scam is one of the main reasons LTC Global was shuttered. Big scams tend to draw the ire of governmental regulations, so its very important to avoid them at all costs.

Offline WoodTech

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2013, 10:30:47 PM »
Will CIPHERMINE and CIPHERMINE-PT be one then?

No. We will reconstitute them as they are, one on the LTC market the other on the BTC market.

Quote
Will the API be the same as it was on ltcg i.e. verbatim for trading and stuff? Or just functionally the same?

It will be syntactically the same, so yes a copy. The idea is that apps that were working with the old sites will work with our without needing to re-write the API drivers.

Quote
Integrating the forum is interesting. Hope there wont be clash of interests right there...

We absolutely don't want to compete with this forum. However, in my view this board is inadequate for the detailed discussions of the securities community. It will be much better to have one board for every security, where they can have a thread for each topic rather than one massive thread with everything in. Also, I personally find it frustrating having to cross-post things here and on bitcointalk.org, so it will bring them together in one place.

Quote
Also, will you categorically exclude doing highly questionable stuff like the labcoin IPO? Are there statutes of any sort?

In short, yes, and what Benny said is spot-on. It is important for the health of the market that we ensure securities are of a high quality. On the one hand, we will be verifying issuers' identities to some degree, and on the other we will be checking the plans and contracts. Where possible we will do basic due dilligence too (eg. if there is an existing company behind the security we'd look up their details). As Benny describes, the advisory board will be assisting with this as well of course; their experience will be invaluable.

If the plan and/or contract look dodgy (eg. poorly planned / described, unsustainable, or not good good for shareholders) then the security won't be approved. While the LTCG approach of "peers" / moderators was interesting, we approvals as something for the exchange to be doing not a few semi-anonymous people who happen to be able to afford to buy votes. However, wherever possible we will allow the market to choose; if a business model is high-risk and likely to fail, but is well-described and thought through, we would approve it and let the market decide.

Just as with a market like AIM or NASDAQ, we will also continue to police the securities after IPO. In the event that something fishy is going on we will freeze trading on the security.

Fundamentally what Benny said is key; the best way to avoid attracting the wrath of regulatory bodies is to ensure people are not being scammed.

Kate.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2013, 10:34:51 PM by WoodTech »

Offline WoodTech

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2013, 10:37:41 PM »
The following will be listing on your board:
DMS.MINING, DMS.SELLING & DMS.PURCHASE
BUY-A-HASH
LTC-CHARTS (cryptocoincharts.info)
S.OPENRIGS


Were any of the owners of these securities promised shares or kickbacks in ciphertrade for listing on the site?

Yes. For starters, as mentioned, we're incentivising issuers by sharing the trading fees with them. DMS.* and BUY-A-HASH are operated by members of the advisory board and they are also investing so will be shareholders.

For major, solid securities that we want to get onto the exchange we're also offering the incentive of a token shareholding in exchange for migrating to us (applies to S.OPENRIGS and LTC-CHARTS).

Kate.

Offline zaXuzI

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2013, 10:52:33 PM »
Looks like CipherTrade is on track to be a winner :) Keep up the good work !

What I consider important :
   1. Security
   2. Security
   3. Security
   4. Graphs: long-term graphs (multi-year) and graphs for currency-pairs (not only against BTC but also USD and/or EUR)
   5. Profit/loss calculator (example: http://my-btc.info)
   6. To have at least the 3 biggest cryptocurrencies: BTC, LTC and PPC (see: http://coinmarketcap.com)
   7. Live order book (bid-ask graphs)
   8. Live BTC, LTC and PPC quote comparisons between MtGox, Bitstamp, BTC-E
   9. Mobile app
  10. Marketing: clear explanation why CipherTrade is better and deserves our trust!
  11. Chinese translation

PS: Only go live when you're ready !
« Last Edit: November 16, 2013, 11:02:17 PM by zaXuzI »

Offline tony.vonver

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2013, 10:59:29 PM »
Very exciting news...

We shall be IPO'ing CipherTrade itself on its own exchange to give everyone an opportunity to  join in our vision, and to raise further funding to continue to expand rapidly.
Will you guys announce a specific date for that or just list it as soon as the site opens up?

We will soon be starting penetration tests with our CHECK-approved partner, Encription. Obviously security is paramount so we want to ensure we've rattled all the latches before public release.
Very glad to read that!

About your comment regarding people using weak passwords and getting hacked as a result, I would still enforce the use of strong passwords. There are some nice UI elements that show the strength of passwords in real time, I find psychologically it encourages people to go for good passwords (even consider a client-side password generator maybe?). People getting hacked is always bad press, even if it's their fault!

Offline cryptol0rd

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2013, 11:22:33 PM »
This looks good.
Quote
ability to trade in securities

Will it be possible to trade stock in one company for stock in another company directly?

Like a swap of Ciphermine stock ---> Asicminer?

Trading stocks could be implemented fairly easily with a dashboard which lists various stocks being swapped and the ratios just as with trading coins. In the future this could even be expanded to include smart property and more exotic crypto-asset trades.

On similar sites there were situations where one security would crash or bad news and people would then sell to buy the competition when they want to swap that security for that of the competitor. They would have to sell their shares and then buy it when it's much easier to directly swap. Direct swap would save time for people who want to hedge between the price differences of Ciphermine, Asicminer and Activeminer for instance.

I appreciate that Ciphertrade cares about privacy of the issuer enough to agree to allow the issuer to remain anonymous while also complying. That is very useful. I've done some research and I believe Ciphertrade will be the leading centralized exchange.

How to allow for voting on new features such as betting and more traditional crowd funding and on new coins to accept? When can we expect launch? Are we days away or weeks away?
The following will be listing on your board:
DMS.MINING, DMS.SELLING & DMS.PURCHASE
BUY-A-HASH
LTC-CHARTS (cryptocoincharts.info)
S.OPENRIGS


Were any of the owners of these securities promised shares or kickbacks in ciphertrade for listing on the site?

Yes. For starters, as mentioned, we're incentivising issuers by sharing the trading fees with them. DMS.* and BUY-A-HASH are operated by members of the advisory board and they are also investing so will be shareholders.

For major, solid securities that we want to get onto the exchange we're also offering the incentive of a token shareholding in exchange for migrating to us (applies to S.OPENRIGS and LTC-CHARTS).

Kate.

If they delist or turn against Ciphertrade later do they get to keep their shares? What if securities initially agree to be listed but then after receiving and selling whatever shares they change their attitude? Otherwise I think it's a very good idea.
Very exciting news...

We shall be IPO'ing CipherTrade itself on its own exchange to give everyone an opportunity to  join in our vision, and to raise further funding to continue to expand rapidly.
Will you guys announce a specific date for that or just list it as soon as the site opens up?

We will soon be starting penetration tests with our CHECK-approved partner, Encription. Obviously security is paramount so we want to ensure we've rattled all the latches before public release.
Very glad to read that!

About your comment regarding people using weak passwords and getting hacked as a result, I would still enforce the use of strong passwords. There are some nice UI elements that show the strength of passwords in real time, I find psychologically it encourages people to go for good passwords (even consider a client-side password generator maybe?). People getting hacked is always bad press, even if it's their fault!

Two-factor authentication should work. I think Ciphertrade should seek to move away from the password paradigm though because there are other better security mechanisms which can be considered now which don't rely on the user memorizing a password. When those mechanisms are ready for prime time then Ciphertrade should offer them.

Example offerings include:
SQRL https://www.grc.com/sqrl/sqrl.htm
Keyhotee ID http://invictus-innovations.com/keyhotee/
Bitcoin identity protocol https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Identity_protocol_v1
Or using the Wallet address itself as an identifying mechanism. The Keyhotee idea does not require a password be stored anywhere on any central database so there is nothing to attack. SQRL also does not store any password so it cannot be compromised. Additionally the Trezor wallet can also act as a very good authentication mechanism.

If Ciphertrade has an eye on the future then there will be many opportunities to offer options which move beyond the security limitations of the password. It may even make sense to provide an incentive to users who use these newer and more secure methods of authentication.




« Last Edit: November 16, 2013, 11:41:43 PM by cryptol0rd »

Offline evilscoop

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2013, 11:38:33 PM »
Looks like CipherTrade is on track to be a winner :) Keep up the good work !

What I consider important :
   1. Security
   2. Security
   3. Security
   4. Graphs: long-term graphs (multi-year) and graphs for currency-pairs (not only against BTC but also USD and/or EUR)
   5. Profit/loss calculator (example: http://my-btc.info)
   6. To have at least the 3 biggest cryptocurrencies: BTC, LTC and PPC (see: http://coinmarketcap.com)
   7. Live order book (bid-ask graphs)
   8. Live BTC, LTC and PPC quote comparisons between MtGox, Bitstamp, BTC-E
   9. Mobile app
  10. Marketing: clear explanation why CipherTrade is better and deserves our trust!
  11. Chinese translation

PS: Only go live when you're ready !

1,2,3 planned and a given, we are undertaking ddos protection and pen testing, from independent, recognized firms.
4. planned
5 planned
6 from day one
7 from day one, I hope
8 not sure the relevance, and ltc is an ltc for a share price, we dont care about exchange rate...thats a diff issue.
9 planned, and semi developed already
10 expect lots of......mostly Ill be looking after all of this so expect lots of posts etc ;)
11 translations are being considered, but are a lower priority to some of the more basic requirements, understandably...though china translations are probably some the higher ones on the agenda :D


Offline evilscoop

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2013, 11:40:47 PM »

We shall be IPO'ing CipherTrade itself on its own exchange to give everyone an opportunity to  join in our vision, and to raise further funding to continue to expand rapidly.
Will you guys announce a specific date for that or just list it as soon as the site opens up?

It will be a specific date, after the v1 launch and the early adopters have moved in...

Offline bunkboy

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2013, 12:29:40 AM »
i thought i posted this but maybe i forgot or maybe it got deleted.
please make sure the backend is REALLY secure so there are no real/fake hacks that everyone is grown accustomed to.
thanks

Offline Shivan Raiders

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Re: Request for input on CIPHERTRADE, a new multi-coin securities exchange
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2013, 01:18:19 AM »
Kate,

Congrats so far on your progresss, I am impressed to see your vision of the site and I am looking forward to trading on it.  I usually don't post, but actually created an account to share one of my favorite things from trading on LTC and BTC Global that I have never seen anyone talk about.   This was the ability to place a buy order for multiple securities with the same BTC, for example, if I had a balance of 10 BTC, I could put in a 10btc order for Cognitive, AND a 10btc order for ASICMINER, AND a 10btc order for bASIC MINING.  This effectively multiplied my buying opportunity and I was able to support (and profit) from securities that had a sudden and unexpected drop.  I have not seen any other trading site and I personality HATE missing out on those opportunities when they come up.  Usually when I am sleeping  ;)

There are many other more important items than this, however, I believe that it was one of the many good things that Burnside did right to bring bigger money to the exchange.